Now this would be a fun project Richard!

I've made a few sites to track my scores and WinBowl is the go to legacy app for it.

A web version would be useful!

I need to get back to WIP: 🔒https://github.com/AlexHedley/bowling-app/pull/1

I haven't built a Bowling League Database yet, but this would be an excellent project. Bowling is one of those subjects I know pretty well, too. I bowled in leagues from about age eight through high school, both league and recreationally, and then again as an adult. My son and I even bowled together in a men's league when he was in his 20s, and I was in my... uh... late 30s. LOL

I'm not bowling right now. I eventually reached the point where I hated the commitment of league bowling, even though I still love the game. Thursday night would roll around while I was relaxing in the pool or enjoying something else, and I'd think, "Damn it, I've got to go bowl tonight." Or it'd be the middle of winter up in Buffalo, and it's like, "I got to get all dressed up, clear the snow off the car, and trudge out to the bowling alley." No thanks. I got the same way with softball. When you're playing five or six nights a week all summer, you can eventually start resenting something you normally enjoy.

But this would definitely make a fun database project. You've got leagues, teams, bowlers, seasons, weeks, matches, games, handicaps, averages, standings, high games, high series, and all kinds of statistics to track. There's plenty there for a nice TechHelp series, so I'm adding a Bowling League Database to my project list... Which admittedly is insanely long, but I'm going to move this up toward the top because this would be a project I would probably really enjoy building. I can already envision some really good extended cuts too.

And speaking of bowling, I used to get into arguments with guys in the men's league because I'd call bowling a "game," and they'd insist, "It's not a game. It's a sport."

I have my own definition, and I'm sticking with it: to me, what makes something a sport is defense. One team's offense has to adjust to what the other team is doing defensively. Baseball is a sport. Football is a sport. Basketball is a sport. Hockey is a sport. Tennis is a sport because what your opponent does directly affects what you have to do next.

Bowling, to me, is a game. There's no defense. It's you against the pins. Golf is a game for the same reason. Sure, you're competing for a better score than everyone else, but nobody can actually defend against your shot. You're basically competing against yourself and comparing the result afterward.

Unless, of course, you're Happy Gilmore and somebody is standing there yelling, "Jackass!" while you're trying to make your putt. Then apparently golf has defense. Shooter McGavin probably wouldn't approve, but I might have to make an exception.

And I actually have a bowling story that proves how much outside interference can matter.

My son had a perfect 300 game going during one of our sanctioned men's league nights. He made it all the way to the 10th frame and got the first strike. If you've ever been in a bowling alley when somebody has a 300 going, you know what happens. Word spreads, everybody stops what they're doing, and suddenly the whole damn bowling alley gets quiet because everyone is watching. That alone is enough pressure.

He's getting ready for his second ball in the 10th. He's completely locked in. He starts his approach...

And some asshole comes over the bowling alley loudspeaker:

"The snack bar is closing in five minutes."

I watched my son do this tiny little stutter step. It was just enough to throw off his approach, and that was it. 7/10 split. Perfect game gone.

We were both pissed. This wasn't just screwing around on a Saturday afternoon, either. It was a sanctioned league. That concession-stand guy owes my son a 300 ring.

So maybe bowling does have defense after all. :)

Richard Would you consider Lawn Bowls a game or a sport?

You could record one today :-) 🎳

Bowling used to be one of my favorite games, right up until my ex-girlfriend dropped a ball and turned my poor pinky finger into puree. After that tragedy, I decided curling was way safer. :)

You could look at the League Secretary website <https://www.leaguesecretary.com/> to get some ideas on which way you would like to go with your database. I started the design process a couple years ago, but lost interest in it. Now for the past couple years I've been using the League Secretary app on my Android phone and it works flawlessly. For $10.00 a season it beats the heck out of racking my brain trying  to get all the queries and code right. Most bowling centers today use it. On my Tuesday league, our team splits the cost and I send them the pdf results after the bowling center publishes the standings Just my humble 2¢

Awesome, thanks for the tip!

I’m loving the sound of this as a project. I was a casual bowler, but not anymore due to having orbited the sun to many times. Richard please move it up your project list, it may even encompass some of the other projects on the list!

So is running a sport, game, or just exhausting?

Monica It depends on who you're running from. LOL

Monica running is sadness wrapped in pain. I hate running. I've always hated running, even when I was younger and in good shape. I love taking good walks, though, and I used to love riding my bike when I had two working eyes.

So, Richard, is the Fitness Database project complete? I thought there was going to be more chapters, and the online version of DB!! That is such a cool project.

Mario R Lots more is coming. I've just been busy with other stuff, but I do look forward to getting back to that soon.

How did this get so off subject? I am currently bowling in a league. More that anything about my interest in this is how they built the database used at this website, https://www.leaguesecretary.com
I don't know how to structure  this. It sounds like it would need at least 4 or 5 tables, and then how to do the calculations.
Either way, thank for you too showing an interest in this idea. I appreciate your input.

More than...
thank you....
I guess a got up too early this morning.

I would love to see this as well.  I am working on something similar.  I am part of a Bocce league.  We have two seasons (Summer and Fall) and have 8 teams playing six days a week.  There is an early match and a late match each day.  Each match is a best of three games.  I am having a difficult time trying to figure out how to create a schedule and record scores/wins/losses.

Here is a sample of my leagues bowling stats.

https://www.oreilly.com/library/view/sql-queries-for/9780321444431/9780321444431_app02lev1sec4.html

Not watched it yet:
MS Access Bowling Score Sheet
@techieyondan6543
https://youtu.be/_NP2UiJhQmk

Bowled Over by SQL Window Functions
Dwain Camps - 26th January 2015
https://www.red-gate.com/simple-talk/databases/sql-server/t-sql-programming-sql-server/bowled-over-by-sql-window-functions/

Alex, that looks to be WAY over my head. I am still only listed as an expert by Richard, but I don't get that at all. I wouldn't know how how to make all connections the right way. I didn't realize it would be so complex, but i don't want to give up either.
Thank you for all the input.

It doesn't have to be that complex, David. Alex's example has a full relational schema with tournaments, matches, and a lot of other moving parts. I'd start as simply as possible and build it up from there.

I've added this to my project list because I do want to build it. I've got a couple of other projects to finish before I start a new one, so it may be a little while, but I think this would make a great project.

I have an absolute basic one started, but nothing as cool as what could be possible.

That's perfectly fine. There's nothing wrong with that, and you've used my Rule of Three just fine. If there are three, and no more than three, of something, you can put them in the same table. Storing three games in a single record is just fine.

If you're tracking individual frames, though, you've got 10 frames and up to 21 throws in a game. That would definitely belong in a separate table.

You're doing fine. Keep at it. The best way to learn is to experiment and try building it yourself. If you've got questions, post them here and we'll do our best to get you going.

The sample I posted is our leagues games record from https://www.leaguesecretary.com the one that starts with Brians Angels.
That's what I would like to wind up with. That is what I believe to be over my head.

Bitesize chunks, just write up a list of everything you need first, then you can break it down into the component parts and iterate.

Looks good so far.

WOW!! I followed the links posted by Alex and that blew me away. The big problem I see is posting each ball thrown into the database - 21 possible balls thrown x 4 bowlers x number of teams is a lot of data entry. Not to downplay the project, but for me, I'll continue to use League Secretary.

My best to all working on this project....

League Secretary is Great. I just want to know how it was made, and how it works. As for me, I would really only be tracking my teams data. Four people, Three games for Six Months. This is not something I need to do for the team or league, it's something I want to do so I can say, Now I know how to do that.

John, that's a great point. One practical option would be to take a picture of the final scorecard showing each game and all the frame results, then use AI to scan it and convert the information into a format the database can import. That would save a lot of tedious data entry for every individual throw.

And David, I completely get it. You don't need to replace League Secretary to make this a worthwhile project. Building it just to understand how the pieces fit together is exactly the kind of project that teaches you a ton.

David, I totally understand...

Richard, never thought of using AI in that way, but it would solve the data entry dilemma....

Yeah, I use AI for that kind of thing all the time, especially when the source data is in a format that would be difficult to parse with normal code.

For example, I have an account-balances database that I use a couple of times a week. Each bank and credit-card website displays balances and transactions differently. I can grab the text from the page, hand it to AI, and tell it, "Find my pending balance, actual account balance, and last 10 transactions. Put the result in XML." Then my database can import the XML easily.

The same idea applies here. Take a picture of the bowling score sheet, even if it's displayed on a screen at the bowling alley, and give it to the AI with a specific format to return. AI is very good at taking messy, inconsistent data and turning it into something structured that Access can work with.